William Gleson

Re: Wm Gleeson

Hi Edenhope, welcome to Ireland Reaching Out.

I had a quick look and foud a possible match on the subscription website www.rootsireland.ie :

William Gleeson baptised on the 31st March 1822 in the civil parish of Loughmore county Tipperary, parents Timothy Gleeson and Judith Kennedy from the address Barronstown townland, see https://www.logainm.ie/en/49043

Regards

Anne Marie

Thank you Anne Marie. I am not sure if this is the correct William as his death record shows his mother as Sarah Mallally, but it is uncertain if this is correct either. I will follow up.

Best regards, Edenhope

Hi again

No mother Sarah but there is a Margaret Mullaly:

William Gleeson baptised 27 April 1835 Holycross county Tipperary, father Timothy Gleeson and mother Margaret Mullaly, born a bit later then we thought it seems

Anne Marie

Anne Marie. Thanks for the follow up. 1835 appears to late to be the correct birth time. He appeared in Court in Nenagh Quarter Sessions in 1842 at a recorded age of 20, so a birth time about 1822 would appear to be accurate. Whilst in Australia he always recorded Tipperary as his place of birth, being a convict he could used this to mislead and was actually born in anorther County.

Very grateful for your assistance, Edenhope.

Hi Edenhope, I have looked at the records & it seems that Wm Casey was born in Loughmore in 1822 to Thady & Judith Gleeson. He alongside, Wm Connell, from the other end of the Parish in Castleiney were both transported for seven years in 1842 for grieviously assaulting the Read Brothers in a townsland called Killiniska. I would be interested to hear about the trajectory of William Gleeson's life after he had served his time. Wm Connell, judging by the records, had a difficult time of it, with a series of criminal records for larceny & loitering.

best regards,

Michael (Loughmore Castleiney) 

Hello Edenhope

According to a database of more than 5,000 Gleesons, Timothy was not a common Gleeson first name...and pretty rare in North Tipperary (e.g. Silvermines and Nenagh). I have come across some Timothys in that time period across the boarder in Limerick e.g. parish of Bruff.

The original post refers to Nenagh and Clonmel - if the latter this would suggest a South Tipperary family - perhaos check parishes such as Boherbawn.

If William's trial was held at Nenagh, it would likely have been recorded in the Nenagh Guardian - this newspaper can be accessed at no charge through the National Library of Australia website.

If you identify the parish of your William/Timothy I can check some other records.

Damian John Gleeson

Sydney, AU

Hi Michael

Many thanks for your message and information.

Are you saying that the person's family name was Casey or was it William Casey Gleeson. From all the information I have seen the name was William Gleeson and he was my GG Grandfather. His convict record on arrival in Tasmania recorded the offence as you have mentioned and his partner in crime William Connell.

Regarding the correct name of his parents it was not unusual for convicts to fudge some of their details. In fact the first time William had to record his place of birth in Australia he recorded it as New York, but subsequently showed Tipperary. So the Timothy and Sarah as his parents could be incorrect. Throughout his life none of his children were aware of his convict past. Some assistance may be obtained from the names given to William's first 4 children - Edward, William, Sarah and Timothy.

William life in Australia appeared to go well and as best as I know he managed to keep himself out of trouble. After spending a short holding period in Kilmainham Gaol, William departed Dublin on 22 September 1842 aboard the Navarino and arrived in Hobart (Tasmania/Van Demons Land) on 10 January 1843. His conduct on the voyage was recorded as "well conducted" and on arrival he was graded as a Class 1 prisoner (expected to be well conducted) and assigned a period of 2 years of primary labour. It appears he served his term in the northern part of Tasmania around Longford. He was granted his Ticket of Leave (freedom of movement) in 9/1846 and on 10 September 1847 married a female servant, Elizabeth Wright, who was expecting in Longford. Finally, on 14 November 1848 William was granted a Conditional Pardon.

William and Elizabeth had 2 children in Tasmania and in 5/1850 they migrated to Victoria where William spent the rest of his life. They initially lived in Geelong and had 2 more children (1853 and 1855), but after the birth of their 4th child Elizabeth must have suffered a mishap and no further details of her life can be located. William subsequently met a new partner (Margaret McDonald believed to have been born in Parsons Town, Kings County) and moved to the gold rush area of Ballarat. Over the next 20+ years, William and Margaret had at least 15 children, although at least 10 of these tragically died in their infancy. They lived in an area in the east of Ballarat know as Mount Clear.

Throughout his life William described himself as a labourer, carrier/carter and later as a publican (recorded as the publican of the Buninyong Shire Hall Hotel in Mount Clear). William passed away on 11 November 1894 from a lung infection. He is buried at Ballarat (Old Cemetery). Margaret continued to live in Mount Clear and passed away in 1907.

Thank you for your assistance and I would be very interested in any further information you may be able to discover.

Kind regards Graeme/Edenhope

Hi Damian

Thank you for your information and assistance. Please see the post above for further information re William Gleeson.

As I understand, William Gleeson's trial at the Nenagh Quarter Sessions was held in Clonmel because at that time Nenagh did not have a suitable Court House. So I suspect that he was from the north rather than the south. After the trial, William was held in Clonmel for a few weeks prior to being transferred to Dublin. 

Trying to find his baptism record without knowing his parish is a real "needle in the haystack" job. But I will keep you informed of whatever may turn up.

Kind regards, Graeme/Edenhope

Thank you edenhope. Forgive me with the reference to Wm Casey, this was indeed a typo and probably because I was researching John Casey from the same Parish who was transported in 1828, ultimately settling in Gundaroo and leaving a healthy Casey lineage behind him !

Anyway going back to William Gle(e)son, there is a record on the Parish Baptisimal Registrar for a William Gleeson, son of Thady & Julia of 1822 which corresponds to his age at conviction / transportation in 1842.

(Thady is an ancient Irish Name although seldom features now in popular culture. It is a derivative of Tadhg & Teige with the anglicised version being Tim.)

Regarding his accomplice, William Connell, the fact that there is a match for him also in the Baptismal Registrar with the same age as the Conviction & Transportation records is another indicator that we are possibly dealing with the same individuals.

Their conviction was covered in The Tipperary Free Press at the time. I would suggest that their crime was part and parcel of the Whiteboy Movement of which Loughmore Castleiney was a hotbed.

However the two Williams were transported separately and I presume never crossed each others paths again.

Wm's initial period of indenture was at the Lovely Banks Station.

I found interesting that your William met his first wife in 1847 - his records show that he was censored to 14 days for a liasion with a female servant the same year !

Anyway, keep in touch and do let me know if there is a picture or painting of Wm doing the rounds !

mise le meas,

Michael

Hi Michael

Thanks once again for the very interesting information that is of great assistance to me.

The baptism record is most possibly the correct William, particularly given the connection to the name Tim and to William Connell. Regarding William's mother's name recorded as Sarah in some Australian docs, my understanding is that the Gaelic name for Julia/Judith is Sile. Given that William could not read or write on arrival it could be that when people heard him mention his mother's name in Gaelic they interpreted what he was saying as Sarah (who knows it is all speculation).

I saw a brief mention of the trial in the Kilkenny Evening Post of 16 July 1842, but will follow up your lead.

Mention of the Lovely Banks Station is very interesting which is another lead I will follow up on. Do you mind passing on where your sourced this info.

Finally, re his marriage. My assumption is that the female servant William was found with, and given punishment for, was in fact the same person that he married only 4 weeks later. Elizabeth was recorded as being 16 years old when they married and as she gave birth in March 1848 she would have been 3 months pregnant when they were found together. Maybe William was told to marry Elizabeth by his Superiors and this could have had something to do with their apparent separation 8 or so years later (more speculation).

Thanks again. Respectively yours, Edenhope

thank you Edenhope, thats no problem at all, can you pm me at michealbraonain@gmail.com & I will schedule the bits & pieces I have for you

le meas,

Michael

Hi edenhope

Loved reading the above about William Gleeson as from my research, he is my 3rd great-grandfather. 
I am trying my best to find out more about this line of my family tree before I head to Ireland in a little over a week.

If possible, could you email me at pantherscblw@gmail.com as I would love to ask you a couple of questions if that's ok?

Many thanks in advance,

Warren Taylor

Hi Folks

Just following up on this thread, albeit four years late!  William Gleeson is also my great-great-grandfather. An article in the Waterford Mail on Saturday 28 August 1841 about the episode that led to William Gleeson's transportation to VDL mentions the place name Kiliniskera. Kiliniskera sounded like Kylenaheskeragh. A check of Ireland Valuation Records,1824-1856 shows a Tim Gleeson living at the same property as a Biddy and Edward Mullally in Kylenaheskeragh.  I have two questions:

1. Is there a way of pinning down the Ireland Valuation Records,1824-1856 by year?

2. Could there be any circumstances under which a baptism might not take place until the age of 13 years? The above thread mentions two plausible baptism records in the vicinity:

- William Gleeson, baptised 31 March 1822, Loughmore and Castleiny, Tipperary, father Thady Gleeson and mother Julia Kennedy

- William Gleeson, baptised 27 April 1835 Holycross County, Tipperary, father Timothy Gleeson and mother Margaret Mullally

the 1835 date seems rather late but the name Mullally has made me wonder if there is a connection.

William Gleeson's convict record mentions a brother Edward and a sister Ann, who we have not been able to identify - I am aware that RC parents baptised their babies as soon as possible after birth and that the baptism date is not necessarily the same as the birth date, and read that the PPs often recorded the Latin versions of parents' christian names, rather than the names they were known by, and the difficulties that presents for family historians.

And just to say thank you for running such a fantastic site - I have met a fellow descendant here and have been having a wonderful time with him putting together our Irish story and learning of life in 19th century Ireland from the Irishish perspective.

Susan, New Zealand

Wow, this is amazing. I've just started doing my family genealogy and have been trying to find out info about my great great great grandfather William Gleeson! I was excited last week to find out he was a convict and now to have just learnt so much about him from this thread above is fantastic. I am related to him through his daughter Sarah Ann(e) Gleeson. Now that I know he's buried in Ballarat cemetery I'll attempt to find his grave next time I visit Ballarat!!

Catherine, Victoria, Australia

Hi Catherine, Great to hear from you. William is buried in an unmarked grave at the Old Cemetery. Sarah Ann's brother William James Gleeson is also buried there, as is many other family members. It would be good if we could swap a few notes so feel free to contact me on the email "graemejlee@bigpond.com"  With the great help of Susan, as above, we have more information relating to William Gleeson. In particular, that when transported he was living in the townland of Kylenaheskeragh, parish of Ballygibbon, Tipperary. Baptism records in the Catholic parish of Cloughjordan are not available as far back to confirm if William was born there also, but as a Timothy Gleeson (William's father) and Mullally's (name of William's wife Sarah) were living in the townland according to Griffith Valuations, it is reasonable to assume that this where William was born.

Best regards, Graeme (edenhope) 

Hello Edenhope,

You have your work cut out for you - there are a lot of William Gleesons from the time/place you are searching! 

I have no information on your direct ancestor, but I do have a few thoughts. If your William Gleeson's eldest son was named Edward, the odds are great that his father was named Edward. I'd begin with that premise as Edward is slightly less common than William. Also, the spelling was generally Gleeson rather than Gleason in those days.

I happen to have a Timothy Gleeson line on my tree that probably connects to yours. My earliest Timothy Gleeson was born about 1800 in Borrisokane - quite near Nenagh. He married Margaret Burns and they emigrated to Nepean, Ontario, Canada about 1824. Their children were Anne, John, James, Ellen, Viena, Patrick, Timothy, Catherine, Cornelius, Michael, Bridget, Margaret. 

I haven't traced the line back any further than Timothy, but from his eldest son's name, I'm guessing his father was likely named John and his mother, Anne. If I were working your line, I might try researching a northern Tiipperary family with John and Anne Gleeson as the parents and a son named Edward (and another named Timothy and possibly, a William). I'd begin in and around Nenagh, Borrisokane, Terryglass, etc and search the NLI registers - page by page for the pertinent years. Conversely, you can register with RootsIreland for as little as one day (fee-based) and see if they've indexed records that will lead you to the family.

It's a lot of time/effort but I've broken a number of brick walls in exactly that way. I wish you well.

Frances

Hello Frances,

Thank you for your tips and suggestions and apologies for the delay in responding; time for family history research comes and goes.

While recognizing the folly of making assumptions and taking matters for granted, I am reasonably confident that the Timothy Gleeson in Kylenaheskeragh is most likely the father of our William Gleeson - it was the place that the incident happened that led to William being transported and also residing in the townland were an Edward and Bridget (Biddie) Mullally, most likely the parents of William's mother Sarah Mullally. If Timothy and Sarah Gleeson had 3 children - William, Edward and Ann - then this would match up with William being named afer Timothy's father, Edward being named after Sarah's father and Ann possibly after Timothy's mother. Also, all 4 names - Timothy, William, Edward and Sarah - were given to the children of William in Australia.

All that said, it could be most likely that Timothy was born in a parish other than Kylenaheskeragh and after marriage he and Sarah settled there to be near Sarah's parents/family. With many other Irish ancestors to trace, I am not sure if I will be able to trace Timothy back much further in the near term.

Very best wishes, Edenhope