Looking for Behans of Nenagh Ireland

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Hi Joan M.F..

Welcome to Ireland Reaching Out . . . 

I had a search for your Catherine Behan . . . approx.area Nenagh.Co.Tipperary . . . born 1861.

In "Roots" search engine (paid) . . I found a Catherine Behan  ...(see below) ..born Dec.31st.1860  . . in the Town of Cloughjordan . . which is in close proximity

to the Town of Nenagh. . . .( Map below )        ( she was the only Behan to show up in a general search of Roots ) . . . SO . . I'm guessing that this is your G.'m

her Father registered as Michael Behan . . Mother Judith Houlahan  . . .

Death of a Michael Behan . . . as recorded for Nenagh area . . . (see 3 below)  . . (4 below). . . ( 5 below) . . . 

I searched the Land Owners Tax rolls . . for the Behans . . of that time and area . . nothing . . . 

 

So Joan . . . there is nothing CERTAIN . . in the searches above and below . . . But . . they do look promising . . 

Hope this helps in some little way . . 

Cheers . . Eamonn . . in Tipperary.

 

I searched for Birth records of Michael Behan -- and . . .Judith Houlahan . . . born approx 1837  +/- 10 yrs. . . . nothing  (very little recorded back then )

Witness # 1. James Costello . . . maybe (just maybe) a Friend of Michael Behan ( same age area ) . . see 7 below i.e. Cloughjordan born . . .

Witness #2. Anne Houlahan  . . . similar search re.age . . . (see 8/9 below)

EMLY - - is a village in close proximity to Cloughjordan . . . 

 

 

 

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Further to James Flannery  . . . Flannery is a common surname to Nenagh Town and surrounds .. . (see Flannery 1 below) . . 

If this is your G'father (of Nenagh -- only one showing up for Nenagh Town ) . . . 

When I searched for a record of a Wedding around that time . . . nothing . . . 

https://www.tipperarycoco.ie/heritage/genealogy-centre

The above site is a "Professional " service . . situated in Nenagh Town . . ( it is a PAID service ) . . . and I am not too sure if they can give you much more 

We are both using " Roots " . . . .however . . if ever you plan to visit Nenagh . . it is a worthwhile stop . . 

Memory tells me there was a John Flannery . . involved with the above service . . 

Cheers . . . 

Hi Eamonn:

I am really thrilled to get the information you sent me.  You have opened some new doors for me.

I was in Nenagh in August 2017.  We went to the place where your public records are held but the office was closed because it was a Monday.  It was a worthwhile stop.  We walked around the town and I made a couple of purchases.  An older gentleman stopped to talk to us.  He was not familar with any Behans in the area.  I don't think I asked him about Flannerys.

Catherine Behan was my mother's grandmother and she lived with my mother's family after her husband James passed away.  We have one picture of her as an old woman standing with a young boy.  No one remembers whose boy it is.  She died about seven years before I was born.

From what I have found in my research, I believe I am 100% Irish American.  We were raised in a farming area in central Wisconsin where there was a substanial settlement of Irish.  The Catholic church in the area was built by local farmers and made of stones they collected from their fields.  There are also numerous fences made of stones.  When I got to Ireland the first time I felt right at home.  I was there in 2008 too.

The Irish I grew up with did not talk much about Ireland.  I never asked why or asked about Ireland but now I am immersed in its history and its people.  I am retired so I have lots of time to do research.

On my father's side I am descended from Fitzgeralds and Carews.  I have obtained lots of information about the Carews as some of my ancestors did research and recorded it for those of us who followed them.

Thank you so much for your assistance!  I will think of you as I follow the leads you provided.

Warm regards,

Joan Fitzgerald

Hi,
When I saw this post, grey cells woke up....
Well done to Eammon.
They lived near a family called Dagg. (I remembered the Behan name from this search I did)

In 1901
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Tipperary/Nenagh_Rural…

This is the actual census return form, you will see Michael Behan's signature.
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/reels/nai003895308/

The house and building record
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/reels/nai003895305/

This is a map of the area of Ballinwear, it's north of Nenagh on the N52.
https://www.bing.com/search?q=ballinwear+nenagh+map&qs=n&form=QBRE&sp=-…

Ballinwear is near to Ardcrony, St. Flannan's Church, which comes under the Parish of Cloughjordan, registration district of Nenagh.
Use this site below, records are listed under Nenagh (reg District) more info on the deaths of Michael and Julia (named as Julia not Judith)

https://www.irishgenealogy.ie/en/
I searched for marriages and then deaths.

In the Census Catherine had a brother Thomas, he was a Blacksmith. Sorry this is his death.
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_retu…
I can't find Ann(e) or Patrick.
If I find anyting else I will update.
Margot

 

 

 

Hi Margot:

It is so nice to hear from you.  I've been looking for Behan records for quite a while and then I get two responses in one day!  I have looked over some of the information you sent.  My question about Catherine is that she would be quite a bit older than the other three children in her family if she was born in 1860/1861.  The three children shown would have been born when the Behans were in their '40s and they would have been in their '20s when Catherine was born.  Does that seem feasible?

I have Catherine's obituary.  It says that she was born in 1861 and had two brothers, Patrick and Thomas, who survived her in Ireland.  I had her mother's names as Julia Haughan, which is probably Houlihan.

I really appreciate all the information you sent.  I'll have to study it further.  And, yes, please send any additional information you may find.

Warm regards,

Joan Fitzgerald, Madison, Wisconsin

 

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Hi Joan,

I am conceivably your 6th cousin (or thereabouts). My 3G-grandparents were farmer Thomas Hawley and Judith Behan of Ballycapple, just to the south west of Cloughjordan. They had 10 known children Honora (~1822-1859), Judith (~1824-1884), Michael (~1825-1905), Ellen (~1825-1891), Thomas (~1827-1895), Mary (1831-1894), John (~1832-1908), Anne (1833-1873), Patrick (~1837-1867) and Margaret (~1839-1863). Son Thomas was the only one of their children to stay in Tipperary; he took over the 61-acre farm in Ballycapple. Daughter Anne was the only one whose baptism has been located in the Cloughjordan parish register, baptised 9 June 1833; she married my 2G-grandfather John Kennedy at Grawn Church, Cloughjordan, on 17 February 1855, not long before they emigrated to Victoria Australia where they were early settlers of the Doonybrook/Kalkalo area north of Melbourne (and there is a Donnybrook not far from Cloughjordan). The other eight children all emigrated to the Maitland/Morpeth area in the Hunter Valley of NSW Australia; these eight children are known only from their immigration and death records in Australia. From these immigration records, it is known that mother Judith Behan died before 1850 and father Thomas Hawley died somewhere between 1855 and 1863.

Now on to your possible family. I can add to the information provided by Eamonn and by Margot. I subscribe to the site findmypast.com which has a good selection of Irish records. 

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Michael Dehan and Judith Houlahan and family of Ballinwear
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Michael Behan married Judith Houlahan in the parish of Monsea on 31 May 1860. If you go to https://registers.nli.ie/parishes/0789 and click on the file 02481/01, it will take you to the parish register; scroll to page 161 and you will find their entry.

I could find listings for six children. If you go to https://registers.nli.ie/parishes/0775 and click on file 02482/01, you will find the entries at the pages listed. Note also that Judith's surname caused the priests some trouble!
Catherine, baptised 31 December 1861, page 15 (and from what you have just posted is certainly your great-grandmother)
John, baptised ? October 1864, page 29
Michael, baptised 27 November 1868, page 40
Anne, baptised 14 December 1870, page 44
Thomas, baptised 7 December 1873, page 52
Patrick, baptised 24 October 1875, page 56
Each entry includes where the child was baptised -- all start with the letters "Ball" and then a squiggle, but if you compare all the squiggles, you can make out that their place of birth is "Ballinwear", in the civil parish of Kilruane. This gives enough information to locate them in the 1901 and 1911 census as done by Margot.

The 1901 Census described father Michael (b. 1837) as a blacksmith; the household consisted of Michael, his wife Julia, and their children Anne, Thomas and Patrick. The index file can be found at http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Tipperary/Nenagh_Rural…

By the 1911 Census, only the three children remained in Ballinwear. http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Tipperary/Nenagh_Rural…

You can find the relevant historic maps at http://map.geohive.ie/ Type "Ballinwear" into the search panel, and it will zoom into the area of interest. Expand the "Data Catalogue" menu at the top left; the "Historic Map 6 inch Colour 1837-1842" gives the clearest picture of the townland boundaries. I have used their "6 inch Cassini" (which is a clearer copy of the "Historic Map 25 inch 1888-1913") as the basis for the attached map of the Beahan holdings from the 1850 Griffith survey; I have highlighted several key townlands in red outline, and have highlighted several key tenements in green.

The website findmypast.com gave me the Griffith Survey summary (file IRE_GRIFF_256_087 attached) for Ballinwear, showing that John Beahan held about half an acre of land including a forge; this holding is highlighted in the attached map. Since the eldest son of Michael Behan and Judith Houlahan was named John, it is highly likely that Michael's father was this John (hence likely your 3G-grandfather), and that the smithy was passed on from father to son.

The valuation for the buildings there was dated 28 April 1848; the website findmypast.com provided a copy of the "House Book" (attached as IRE_CENSUS_1821-1851...) where the listing was under James Behan. The dimensions are in feet; a rating of 2B- was for a house of medium age, deteriorated by age and not in perfect repair. A modest house.

We can then go back earlier to the Tithe Applotment Book of 1824, available from http://titheapplotmentbooks.nationalarchives.ie/search/tab/results.jsp?…
Michael Behan was holding just over 9 Irish acres (a bit over 14 imperial acres) in Ballinware. This is likely to be the father of John and the grandfather of Michael (and hence likely to be your 4G-grandfather).

This index page of the Tithe Applotment Book shows that there were only ten households of Behan in all of Tipperay, so it was an uncommon name at the time. I have had a look at the two other Behan households that were also close to Nenagh/Cloughjordan.

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Thomas Behan of Grange, Knigh
=============================
This Thomas held just under 4 Irish acres in "Grange Castle" in the civil parish of Knigh in 1826. I couldn't locate any such townland. However, the 1850 Griffith Survey (attached as IE_GIFF_256_090) listed a Thomas Beahan as holding just over 12 imperial acres, including a forge, in Grange Upper. The site findmypast.com includes copies of the 1840s Ordnance survey maps, annotated with the numbering scheme used by the Griffith surveyors. From this, I was able to identity Thomas' holding, highlighted as green in the attached map. Notice it is just to the south of a ruined castle.

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Thomas Behan of Knigh, Knigh
============================
There were two listings in the Tithe Applotment Book for "Thomas Behan & Brothers" holding a combined total of just over 41 Irish acres in 1826 in the townland of Knigh in the civil parish of Knigh. The 1850 Griffith Survey (attached as IRE_GRIFF_256-091) listed Thomas Beahan as holding a bit over 83 imperial acres in Knigh; he was subletting to a John Tracy who had a forge. I was not able to identify Thomas' holding in the Ordnance Survey map, as the surveyors' numbers had not been included in the annotations for that area. However, the 1880s map showed the location of the forge in Knigh as being up in the top left-hand corner so that is where I believe Thomas was located.

It is interesting that all three Behan households were associated with blacksmith forges -- a pointer to them all being descendant from a blacksmith a generation or so further back?

There is not enough information available to work out how my 3G-grandmother Judith Behan of Ballycapple might have been related to your (likely) 4G-grandfather Michael Behan of Ballinwear. The two townlands are only about 7 km apart. They could conceivably have been siblings...

Regards
Dave Kennedy
Newcastle, NSW, Australia

 

Hi David:

Each day since I posted my inquiry about the Behans of Nenagh Ireland I have received a response from a person that fills in more of the pieces of the puzzle.  I am so grateful as I have been searching for Behans for a long time.

I've given a quick review of the information you've sent and will take some time later to go through everything,  The information appears to fit in with the information I received from Eamon and Margot.

I'll get back to you when I've had completed my review.  Thank you for taking the time to give me this information.

Warm regards,

Joan Fitzgerald, Madison, Wisconsin

Hi,
The Hawley family that went to Australia..........
HAWLEY John A 27 1855 22 Ballychapel Thomas/Judy M dead , F at Ballychapel Sis=Ellen KILFOYLE at Maitland Ship = Golden Era
HAWLEY Judith A 27 1851 27 Ballycavan Thomas / Judith Father at Ballycavan Bro = Michael Hawley , Maitland Ship = Garland
HAWLEY Mary 1864 19 Grahnorish (not given) / Ann NEILL M in Grahnorish None. Wife of Patrick,28. Ship = Ida HAWLEY Michael A 27 1850 25 Ballycappel Thomas / Judith Father in ballycappel None . R.C. {husb of Ann , 22.} Ship = John Knox
HAWLEY Michael 1865 29 Ballycappel xx Left Modreeny,Cloughjordan xx Pd for by John McSHANE . Ship = Star of Brunswick
HAWLEY Patrick A 27 1859 20 Cloghjordan Thomas / Julia - Mother dead , Father in Tipp. Cousin = William GLEESON,Morpeth. Ship = Abyssinian

HAWLEY Patrick 1864 28 Grahnorish Both dead" Husb of Mary , 19. Pd for by his Bro = Michael at Morpeth. Ship = Ida
 

Thomas Hawley, some info of his children, 
Michael, married Anne Brennan
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_re…
Julia Hawley married Michael Jones
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_re…

Michael's daughter
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_re…

Margot

Hi Margot:

Thanks for the updated information.  I will incorporate it with the other information I received from Eamonn and Dave and look it all over.  I am certainly going to know more about my Behan ancestors thanks to the three of you.

Many thanks

Joan

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I have just fallen across this site.  Uears ago I spent time looking for immigrants to Australia from Ballycapple and area.  It seems most of the Ballycapple residents migrated to Australia and the Hunter Valley farming area as assisted (by New South Wales Government).  Once the first lot landed there, they quickly started to sponsor other relatives, creating a very complicated set of relationships, which I have not had much luck in sorting.  Anyhow, here is my list of some, but certainly not all of the possible participants.  Dave Kennedy, I also live at Newcastle and am descended fro these folk (The Hawleys, therefore the Behans).  You can find me at denis230840@gmail.com.   Cheers distant rellies---Denis Power

 

Hi, mentioned in this post is Grahnorish, please look at these 2 links, Hawley's are listed.
Cheers
Margot

http://www.interment.net/data/ireland/tipperary/grawn/index.htm

https://www.findagrave.com/cemetery/2493341/grawn-church

 

 

 

https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/55174781/catherine-flannery

http://www.willcalendars.nationalarchives.ie/search/cwa/results.jsp?dec…

 

Hi Joe:

I see that you accessed my message about Behans in Nenagh, Ireland yesterday.  However, I do not see a message.  If you sent a message could you resend it?  If you did not message, just ignore this message and I will know that you did not respond to my post.

Thank you for your consideration.

Joan Fitzgerald

Oh, sorry Joan I did not put a message but put 2 links above. You probably saw the find a grave one already, the other is wills I beleive.                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/55174781/catherine-flannery                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                http://www.willcalendars.nationalarchives.ie/search/cwa/results.jsp?dece...

 

Thanks Joe.  I did not look above your name to see the links.  I do have those documents but appreciate your time and effort in sending links to me.  Behans and Flannerys are my mother's family. I am still researching those ancestors so if you find additional information feel free to send it to me.

Have a great day!

Joan Fitzgerald

Hi Joan,

In this thread you wrote 

On my father's side I am descended from Fitzgeralds and Carews.  I have obtained lots of information about the Carews as some of my ancestors did research and recorded it for those of us who followed them.

I descend from a Carew/Carey line from Kilcommon, Co Tipperary. Would love to connect and share info!

Dawn Carey Henry

Hi Dawn:

I live in Wisconsin, USA. The first record I have of a Carew coming to America is Michael Carew and his wife Ann Hogan and their 4 children coming with Peter Robinson's group to Canada in 1825.  They came from the Donaskeagh area of Co. Tipperary.  That family eventually emigrated to Wisconsin and their son, born in Canada, is my great great grandfather.  His name was James Carew and he married Mary Ann  Doran.

Have you had your DNA tested.  I had mine tested through Ancestry.com and according to them I am 100% Irish American.  From what I have gathered from 4 four lines they all did come from Ireland and when they came to US they married Irish that first generation at least.  My mother and her two sisters married 100% Irish Americans but the Irish gets diluted after that.

I have a large family tree on Ancestry.  Tell me a little about you and we can go from there!

Joan Fitzgerald