William Beauchamp Begnall Harvey and link to BB Harvey

From "Cantwells Memorials of the Dead" (Wexford)

Mayglass cemetery;

Family burial ground of Joseph Harvey, Wellington Cottage Wexford.

Beacuchamp Bagenal Harvey, Bargy Castle, Commander of Insurgents, beheaded on Wexford Bridge 1798.

John Harvey Esq. Mt. Pleasant; 15/8/1784 (80)

John Harvey; Bargey Castle; 4/6/1834 (76)

Mary Harvey, eldest dtr of John Harvey of Mt Pleasant, 24/2/1794 (7)

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Jack Mc Donald

Rathaspeck cemetery; Wexford.

Martha Harvey, wife of Rev. James Harvey, Killiane Castle, and daughter of John Beacuchamp, Ballyloughlane Co. Carlow, for many years in Parliament in Old Leighlin Carlow, 23/12/1760 (66)

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Jack Mc Donald

Houses of Wexford. ( David Rowe and Eithne Scallan) ISBN 0 946538 46 8

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Bargy Castle Tomhaggard. Townland-Bargy

In the seventeenth William Ivory sold this premises to the Harveys, who retained the property for some 300 years.

Beacuchamp Bagenal Harvey was a leader in the rebellion of 1798 when historic meetings took place here at Bargy Castle.

By 1811 it was shown as the the residence of James Harvey and in 1878 John Harvey controlled an estate of 1,323 acres at Bargy.

Sold in 1947.

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Jack Mc Donald

Thank you so much for the background info. It's useful to add some details but what we're really looking for is a strategy to connect our William Beauchamp Baganel Harvey with Beauchamp Bagnell Harvey of the Bargy Castle Harveys. 

If we can make that connection the rest of it seems fairly easy by comparison! (He said without the slightest hint of irony LOL)

Where could we start to look for details about Elizabeth Smith and her sons William and James Harvey and what became of them. What was the fate of children born out of wedlock in those days?

Are the wills proven in Dublin available or can they be searched on line and ordered?

THe nature of the parish system would seem to present a myriad of hurdles in terms of searching. Is there a way to narrow down a search of birth records and deaths (though clearly we know what happened to poor BB Harvey.)

Indeed we've found quite a bit of material on the Harveys of Bargy Castle.

There was also a bit of cousins marrying cousins so they weren't just kissing cousins apparently.

Rev. William Harvey was mayor of Wexford in 1753 Will proved in Dublin 1765 succeeded by third son (by wife Susanna) Francis Harvey who also became a Reverend and though he was the third son, ended up inheriting because his father disinherited the first two sons (Ambrose and John)

The inheriting son, Rev Francis Harvey  married Martha, the eldest daughter of Rev. James Harvey of Killilane Castle (apparently his wife was also called Martha and is buried at Rathaspeck cemetery from the information just furnished. Her father appears to have been John Beauchamp which is worth following up since it seems to link the name Beauchamp (good Norman-french name) to the tree)

They bore:

Beauchamp Bagenal Harvey

James

Susannah

Martha who married Gregory Byrne but had no kids

Julia

Francis, John, William and James are very common names in our tree and strangely enough so is Beauchamp Bagenal.

There were a couple of John Harveys who were either MPs or Councillors at a time in Wexford over difference generations and it is one of these John Harvey's who inherits the estate or what's left of it from James Harvey, the brother of Beauchamp Bagnel Harvey who of course was executed.

James, the story goes, was living in London and didn't spend a lot of time at Bargy. He died without children, his will was proved in Dublin and he passed the estate on to Col. Robert Harvey, his cousin.

Col Harvey was dead at that point however so the lapsed legacy fell to his heir, his brother John Harvey, a barrister and MP from Mount Pleasant.

He restored much of the castle before it was sold and eventually it ended up with the De Burghs.

So again thanks for all this stuff and I am in your debt. I hope to add more to this story if I can make that connection as I said. The dates are close, the names are correct and the fact that Beauchamp Baganel Harvey survived as a middle name in our family and used three or four times ....It's not like they named their kids Tom, Dick and Harry. Beauchamp Baganel is a formidable moniker and would have been applied with purpose. I'm guessing its to honour a man who stood up for basic human rights and paid the ultimate price. Maybe I'm romanticizing a bit but we all love a good story.

Just to add some spice to this, there's another William Beauchamp Baganel Harvey, born in Dublin in 1819 about the same time our William BB Harvey the older was having his brood of five kids in Edinburgh. He became an engineer and died in Calcutt in 1859.

We have an 1881 census that the two families knew each other and lived in the same house in London at one time. So there's a connection there. But the mystery remains. 

Was the William Beauchamp Bagenal Harvey who sired my great grand dad times six in 1816 in Edinburgh the illegitimate son of BB Harvey the rebel leader. Is so what happened to him and his brother James? And how does the other William Beauchamp Bagenal Harvey, the engineer born in Dublin who died in India, fit in to this story?

As always, any ideas, leads, links would be greatly appreciated. It may come down to some old fashioned leg work but it would be better to have a plan of attack rather than just stumbling around in the dark.

My mother is Antoinette Harvey, last Harvey of Bargy Castle. She was born in the bedroom above the front door and now lives in South Africa. I am the last child listed under, Harvey, in Burke's Peerage landed Gentry of Ireland and live in Montclair, New Jersey, USA. I think we're related? I went to visit Bargy about 10 years ago and met the present owner. It is a beautiful place. The owner is a very keen historian on the Harvey family. You should speak with him. Also, facebook is a great way to find people now too. This is a tough website to navigate! Best of luck! Rachael (Harvey) Egan (;

too funny. My parents lived briefly in Wachung Junction near Montclair in the early 1970s...I stayed in school in England. After that we all moved to Toronto Canada.

And yes, we are probably related.....looks like we're going in September....not sure if the De Burgh family still owns it.
Because the offspring William and James were born out of wedlock  - she being catholic and he being the son of a protestant minister.....we'll never likely have the trail to confirm the blood line....still it makes a great story to tell around the dinner table!!

That is amazing, Ian Harvey! There is a wonderful cottage you can rent right next door to the castle.  http://www.tripadvisor.com/VacationRentalReview-g2065496-d2068106-Bagen…;

I plan on staying there one day myself. My mum tells me that growing up in Bargy castle was pretty drafty, and that much of it was falling apart after the war, but says it was great for games of hide and seek. All my life she has preferred everything to be super modern and new, because she said she had enough of really old things. Evidently the castle was full of old paintings and antiques which they didn't take with them when they left, thinking them worthless. My grandfather went broke building a retirement "hotel" free for old soldiers nearby, and had to sell Bargy. 

Sad, I would have loved to have lived there! My grandmother Henrietta Harvey lived with us before she died and said that there was an awful snobbery in Wexford when she lived there, with protestants looking down their noses at catholics etc. When I went to visit Bargy, some long time neigbors (hundreds of years) came to call in to see me, and when I complimented the tea cakes that were served some one said in a strong Queen's English accent-  "Oh yaaass, they came from the local bakery, the Irish have become rather good with pastries of late."  I got the feeling she still didn't quite consider herself "Irish", which in her world probably was code for Catholic! (; My mother married a Catholic, and I grew up knowing that my Irish parents were a mixed marriage. Ireland was a crazy place! Good luck with your visit. I'd love to hear about it!

Hi

Been a while but we went to Ireland in September and visited Bargy and met Maeve Davidson, singer Chris De Burghs mum and had a look around.
I hooked up through a very distant cousin I found online who was a local historical society member and very helpful. She lives in the castle across the road which was given to her family the Boxwells when they married into the Harveys waay back in the 1600 or 1700s.

She was most helpful.

The castle isn't anything like the Disney version of castles. It's a bit austere isn't it. But fascinating history. We picked up some pastries to share with Maeve over tea. It was a lovely visit.
I went to BB Harvey's grave and got a tour of Wexford and the pertinent sights and soaked up a lot of history about the 1798 rebellion.
I've also hooked up with a fellow in Ireland who is researching a book about BB Harvey. At some point I think there may even be a romantic historical novel about BB Harvey. Some interesting stuff came to light about his string of lady friends, his bastard kids and why he never married their mother - she was socially unacceptable.....Jane Austen captures most of that era in her writings.

Anyway just wanted to book end the discussion....cheers!!!

This is most interesting.  I am researching my husband's great great grandfather Major Harvey Welman originally from County Wexford who was a cousin of Bagenal Beauchamp Harvey. Any information of the Welman family would be much appreciated. We are visiting Ireland in May and hope to follow the route of the 1798 uprising. Harvey Welman joined the British Army in 1802 and was at the buriel of Sir John Moore at Corunna - surprising as it was Sir John Moore who finally took back Wexford from the Rebels!

Jane Thomas

the only cousins I know of from that period are the Boxwells.....

Hello i am the Australian Connection to the Harvey Family name i was told by my grandfather that around the 17th-18th century we crossed over from Ireland to scotland it goes like this -(Beauchamp Bagenal Harvey Born Ireland 1762:D 1798)-William Harvie- (Son of Beauchamp Born Ireland:1796 D:Scotland-1866) Francis Harvie(Son of William Harvey/Harvie B:1831 D:1902) The reason i am sure that Bagenal Beauchamp Harvey is related to my side of the family is because,1.Bagenal Was the only person i could find on ancestry that had a son William Harvey that Had a Son Francis and i searched for hundreds of hours thousands of Records everysingle Record and nothing except This one and how my name came to be changed from ey to ie When they Immigrated across from Ireland to Scotland where they stayed in Dalry. I have also read that we Harvey's/Hervey's/Harvie's are all the same we all share the same ancestors that came over with William the conqueror here is my short Explination of Immigration and Travel. Norway-France-England-Ireland-Scotland-Canada-Australia i have read many books on civil wars and thought why our family might want to move from a certain spot to another so drastically the earliest i have currently seen is Somerset England. In somerset the water around the 13th/14th Century was 2m above sea level which was destroying all of the farming lands and structures in somerset. The civil War In somerset https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Somerset . That Link Explains Somersets History and why our Family would want to move along They went from Somerset to Wales then to Ireland while their Cousins the Herveys where Earls for Example the Earl of Bristol so it would make sense that a family moves into an area that they could control anyway back to the Point.They Moved to Ireland Wexford and bought a Norman castle/Fort because i think the civil war that they lost in somerset resulted in the destruction of many castles may have been some of theirs so they decided to get out of england before they could be killed and fled to Ireland but im pretty sure most of the Hervey's stayed but the Harvey's left to go to ireland and scotland and im sure Harvie and Harvey was changed after we left Ireland to Scotland. I hope this can give you some help i described it as best as i could and i am guessing that we should be Not too distant Relatives if you are related to Beauchamp Harvey. Heres a Key name too Look up that can peice everything together for the English Part of us in the early medieval history-Robert Fitz-Harvey son of Harvey Duke of Orleans.-Josh Harvie 

Hi again! We are visiting Ireland for the first time in many years and this time I want to take my kids to see where their grandmother (Antoinette Harvey) was born, in the room over the front door of Bargy Castle. I am going to see the Bagnel harvey museum etc. too. Any suggestions for places to visit that are related? Also- I would love any contact details you might be able to share so that I might be able to call the occupants to ask permission to come and visit? My e-mail address is mydoghouse@mac.com. My Mum remembers the Boxwells! Many thanks, Rachael (Harvey) Quinn Egan.

The Harvey family are interesting to me as I am writing up the family history of the Welman family.  Catherine Harvey of Killiane Castle married William Welman. It was her brother James who married Martha Beauchamp and their daughter Martha married The Rev Francis Harvey of Bargy Castle - most confusing.  I believe the Harveys also intermarried earlier as Catherine and James Harvey's father John had a younger brother called Ambrose and this name comes up on the Bargy Harvey line - am trying to link this so any help appreciated. The Rev Francis Harvey's grandfather was called Ambrose so perhaps this is him. Jane T

Hi I never get updates as to whether anyone has left a post here....so I apologize. I also apologize if I did respond to your request and then responded again. Can't remember who I did get back to...they really need a better platform for this!!!

Tthe Harvey names are from a small pond. John, Francis, James and William mostly though Bagnell seemed to have quite the moniker which led to me connecting our family tree to Ireland.
The girls were Catherine, Francis, Magdene, Elizabeth

While I went to school in England I never knew much of Irish history. Surprise, that.
Indeed the names seem to be consistent with the history I have.
Burke's Peerage has an entry on the Harveys going back to when they arrived in Ireland......though there's some confusing because there are no records. One account has us coming to England in 1066 with William the Conquerer as mercenaries from Brittony. The Harveys (Robert FitzHarvey) were granted titles and land in south east England which is where I was born and our name is quite common.
They ended up in Bosworth the Ireland, buying Bargy Castle from William Ivory.

All the Harveys from that point appear to have been lawyers, all attending Trinity College and all appointed to prestigoeous positions.
BB Harvey was a lawyer too as was his brother James. But he was a gadfly.

I think that's the one family trait that shows up consistently in our family tree....Gadflys, contrarians and bohemian!!!

Good luck. If you need anymore on the Harveys, I'm at ian@pitbullmedia.ca

Hi I've only just found this as I am looking into our ancestry. It is possible we are connected through the London Harvey family. My maiden name is Harvey - Joann and I have an older sister Ann, our father was born in 1922 Robert Harvey and our grandfather John Harvey was born in London 1890, we have managed to trace back one generation further and then hit a wall. It may just be coincidental that we all have such an awesome name! Or it could be that we really are connected. Either way I could really use some help please. Most of my family have passed away. Only myself, my sister and our children remain. As my parents had me late in life I wasnt able to ask all the questions i now have about where we came from. I know this thread is old but hoping to hear from you soon. Thanks