McElroy/Adams/Allen in Londonderry

John McElroy?s property in Altnagelvin is listed in Griffiths Valuation for 1858. It was plot 11, which was a farmhouse, outbuildings and about 10 acres, rented from John Adams. The revaluation records show that he was replaced by John Arthur in 1876 (not Joseph Adams). The property today is on the east side of the Glenshane Rd, at the junction with Daly?s Brae. It appears to be adjacent to the Altnagelvin Hospital complex, and seems likely to have been demolished. There?s a Grovemount Park estate in Altnagelvin which appears to occupy most of the farmland of Grovemount farm.

I note that you think John McElroy might have moved to Scotland. Nevertheless I searched for a death for John McElroy 1873 to 1880. There?s just one who died on 30^th May 1874. Est year of birth 1804. You might want to look at that to see if it relates to the Altnagelvin McElroy family. You can view it on the GRONI site for ?2.

https://geni.nidirect.gov.uk

Griffith?s clerks were often a year or two late in catching up with deaths and changes of tenants so the name change in 1876 probably fits quite well with a death in 1874.

Though Joseph Adams? address on the marriage certificate is given as Glasgow, that doesn?t mean he was born there (though he might have been). It just means he was living there when he married. Tradition was to marry in the bride?s church so it would be natural for him to marry in Derry, wherever he came from or lived. However in order to have met her, I would suspect he originated in Derry and was simply in Glasgow for work (as was half the population of Co Derry). You could have a look for him in the 1851 census on Scotlandspeople, in the Glasgow area, but if he?s not there, that might mean he had not yet arrived from Ireland.

No Adams or McElroy families in Altnagelvin in the 1901 census.

I wonder if this might be some of the family in 1901:

http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Londonderry/Waterside/Ardnabrockey/1539330/

I can see that Thompson Adams was the tenant of plot 3b(a) in Ardnabrockey until around 1901. It was a house, outbuildings and a 1 acre garden. Ardnabrockey is just beside Altnagelvin (It?s the next townland east). Henry McElroy was on plot 2 in 1858 so there looks to have been a family connection with that townland. Plot 3 today is between the modern Drumahoe Rd and the Ardlough Rd.

Here?s the abstract of a McElroy who died intestate:

Letters of Administration of the personal estate of Andrew M'Elroy late of Ardnabrockey County Londonderry Farmer who died 17 April 1885 at same place were granted at Londonderry to Michael M'Elroy of Ardnabrockey Farmer the Brother. Effects ?642

Thank you so much for all this information. I did find John McElroy (I have spelled it McIlroy but never thought to try M'Elroy) in Griffiths Valuation. I do have a John Adams listed in my tree as Joseph's brother, although I'm not sure why. I started this a while ago and am just getting back to it. I also found Joseph Adams in Edenmore plot 4 renting from Marquis of Waterford. I am not familiar with the area so I don't know if that is near where Grovemount was. I wonder if Henry, Michael, or Andrew M'Elroy might be related to Anne and if so, how? I will start searching for them, using the new spelling, and see what I can find.

Most of my information comes from a family history written by a great aunt of mine. At the beginning of her history she said that her parents were both were born in Ireland and that their parents (McElroy & Adams) immigrated from Scotland. She actually traveled to Londonderry as a child and stayed at Grovemount. They went in 1911 and returned in 1912 (theirs was the closest ship to the Titanic but their radio was off for the night). My g.aunt's mother (my g.grandmother) was Josephine Adams Allen. They were visiting her mother Anne McElroy Adams. Joseph Adams (Josephine's father) and John Allen (Josephine's husband) were already deceased. My g.aunt wrote about how Uncle Thompson met them at the dock at the Waterside when they arrived on a tender from Moville. She described Grovemount as "a lovely place - a big house. We went up a lane and through two big iron gates. All along one side of the gravel path were flowers and on the other side pine trees. In the back of the house was a garden of potatoes and vegetables. There was a hedge all around of gooseberries." She and her siblings attended school at the Waterside, except for her brother who attended "The Model School" and she wrote much about that. Unfortunately no McElroys were mentioned, but they did visit her grandfather on their dad's side, John Allen (Sr) in Belfast who lived to be 94. Probably more than you need to know, but I thought you might find it interesting. The link you provided for the 1901 census is indeed my family. The people listed are all mentioned in this history.

Here's what I have on the Allens:

John Allen (Sr) b1828(?) - wife Sarah (?) - children Hugh, Patrick, Thomas, Annie, Sarah, and John Allen who was son-in-law of Joseph and Ann McElroy Adams. I am sure of all the children's names because they were in the history my g.aunt wrote. 

Thank you for telling me where these places would be located now. I live in the US so I use Google Earth a lot to look at Ireland. I recall seeing the Altnagelvin Hospital so now I can go on there and get an idea of where things used to be.

I can't tell you how much I appreciate you taking the time to help me.

The spelling of surnames in Ireland varies all the time so you will need to look out for that. (No-one bothered much about the idea of a single correct spelling).

Regarding whether the Adams family originated in Scotland, I?d say that is very likely. There are several clues. The most important is their denomination ? Presbyterian. The next is that they lived in Co Derry and the third is that they have a surname commonly found in Scotland. Presbyterianism was created in Scotland and brought to Ireland (and elsewhere) by Scots settlers. Apart from the by products of intermarriage, the vast majority of Presbyterians in Ireland are all of Scottish origins. Secondly, Co Derry was one of the counties heavily settled by English & Scottish settlers in the Plantation of Ulster in the 1600s. Further waves arrived throughout the 17^th century due to famine in Scotland. By 1699, some 100,000 Scots had settled in Ireland (representing 10% of the entire population of Scotland). So the area of Ireland where your Adams lived was very heavily settled by Scots. Finally the surname, though not the most common in Scotland, it is found there fairly widely, It?s not a native Irish name either, so that again all points to Scottish origins. As I say, the vast majority came in the 1600s but some did arrive after that. (From the 1700s onwards people were starting to leave Ireland, so the tendency by then was outward rather than further inward migration. So there are 3 pointers to their being of Scottish origins. So your ancestors are almost certainly what, in Ireland today, called Ulster-Scots (or, in the US, sometimes Scotch-Irish).

There are 4 people named Adams living in the City of Derry, in 1639 or thereabouts, who are mentioned in the Great Parchment book. So the surname can be traced back that far:

http://www.greatparchmentbook.org/explore-the-book/

Leslie

Here a Civil Birth Record for what appears to be another offspring of Joseph and Ann:

Name: John William Adams
Date of Birth: 18-Dec-1870
Date of Baptism: 31-Dec-1870
Address: Altnagelvin, Glendermot
Parish/District: GLENDERMOT OR WATERSIDE URBAN
Gender: Male
County Co. Derry
Denomination: Registrar District
Father: Joseph Adams
Occupation: Carter
Mother: Anne McElroy
Informant: Anne Adams
Source: www.rootsireland.ie

I am interested in the surname Allen in Ireland, please see the below information and reply if you or someone you know would have interest in participating.

The ALLEN y-DNA Project & The ALLEN Guild of One Name Studies

The Allen DNA Project is partnering with the Allen Guild of One Name Studies in an exciting new Research Endeavor. The Allen DNA Project is a USA based group, but is very interested in expanding our membership to a world-wide audience by actively seeking out Allens from England, Scotland, Northern Ireland, Ireland, Mainland Europe, Canada, Australia, New Zealand or anywhere else on the planet. Additionally, any spelling variation of the Allen surname is welcome: Allan, Allyn, Allin, etc.

To this point, FREE yDNA 12 marker tests will be made available to any males carrying the Allen surname and residing outside the United States who are willing to join the project and participate in the testing. This involves no blood or needles, only a cotton swab rubbed on the inner cheek.

The only requirement for a free yDNA test is a known Allen/Allan (any spelling) lineage to at least the participant’s Great Grandfather Allen/Allan (any spelling) in any country. Additionally, The Allen DNA Project is setting aside a specific Sub-group within the Project with a full commitment of assistance from Allen Project Co-Administrator Dr. Eric Allen who will be overseeing this specific International Sub-group.

Guild of One Name Studies:  http://one-name.org/name_profile/allen/  

Allen DNA Project: https://www.familytreedna.com/groups/allan/about/background 

Direct Contacts:  

Mr. Chris Allen: cdpallen@gmail.com 

Dr. Eric Allen: doughertyallen1759@gmail.com

Regards,

Eric Allen

Hello, 

A few years late to this conversation, but I am an Allen descendent working at a Museum in Philadelphia, USA. My sister and I started digging as part of research for a 1918 flu exhibit at the Mutter Museum I am working on. We are great great grandchildren of Josephine, of the Grovemont house in Londonderry and later Pittsburg, and have accounts of the other Allens in the US We are Nancy Dorothy Hill (born on Dorothy Allen's birthday, July 7th!) and Laura Rose Hill, our Father is Dwight Hill, our Grandfather is Russell Hill, child of Dorothy Allen, Daughter of Josephine.

From what we understand, Josephine and children travelled back and forth to the states through New York due to Josephine's husband's work with Otis elevator in Pittsburg, and ultimate death from a falling wrench in a shaft on the job. We have some ship manifests on this if anyone is interested.

Laura is on Ancestry and can be contacted there, and I can be emailed at nancycdhill@gmail.com to help fill any gaps as far as we know. I am particularly interested in documentation of Hugh Allen's military service and death from pandemic influenza in 1918(ish). Thank You!