James Sarsfield family

Wanda:

Welcome to Ireland Reaching Out!

I checked the subscription site Roots Ireland for the four baptismal records you mentioned. Initially at marriage and for the first two children, James and Jane were living down in the southeast part of Co. Waterford and then moved north to the Tipperary/Waterford border. Ballylooby RC parish is actually in Tipperary but possibly the family lived just across the border in Waterford. None of the baptismal records showed a townland.  Since the marriage was in Stradbally, Jane was likely from that area. The Stradbally records go back to 1806 but I did not find a Jane or Johanna baptismal record around 1816. Same for a James Sarsfield record.  

Sarsfield was not a common surname in Ireland in the 19th century.Holmes was more common and found in Northern Ireland, Dublin, Cork and samller numbers in other counties like Waterford.

Please consider adding the Sarsfield's story to our XO Chronicles site  https://www.irelandxo.com/ireland-xo/history-and-genealogy/ancestor-dat…

Have you considered DNA testing?

Roger McDonnell

Dear Roger,

Thank you for your prompt response!  Yes, I have an account with rootsireland.com and also with Ancestry.com.  Many of my records have come from those sites.  Additionally, I hired a genealogist in Rochester, NY (wherre my 3x's great-grandfather settled after the Civil War).  His work has been ever so valuable.  I have learned so much about my g-g-g-gramdfather from his work. 

I do have a question for you regarding James' name.  According to all the Catholic Parish Records and the US Federal Census records, his name is listed as James Sarsfield.  However, my researcher discovered the documents of his naturalization declaration and the deed for the purchase of property in New York in 1854.  His name is listed as James O'Maughr Sarsfield.  I have been told that "O'Maughr" is a synonym for O'Meagher, O'Mahr, O'Mahar and Mahar.

Could this be a family name, and a possible clue to his family in Co. Waterford?  Is it common in Ireland to use a familial surname as a middle name as well?  I'm just curious, as I can find no other leads to his family.  

Also, do you know if there is any data bank in Ireland to track the emigration during the famine years?  I have searched countless sites for immigration and border crossings and have found nothing.  I even checked the sites for Ellis Island and Grosse' Ile without luck.  I really didn't expect to find anything there knowing that they were in Toronto, Canada in 1847.  Are there ways to find if a family was sponsored or simply fled.  I understand that travel to Canada was cheaper, and they were together as a family.

Oh, one other thing.  On the 1850 US Federal Census, listed with the family was a Mary Fitzgerald.  I don't know who this person was, or what happened to her.  She was about 15 years older than James and Jane at the time (she was 48 in 1850).  I also noted that there were Fitzgerald sponsors for the ceremonies of James/Jane's wedding, as well as the baptisms of Robert and John.  All these events were local to Stradbally and Abbeyside.

And finally, yes I have considered DNA testing.  My father has completed 23andMe.  I purchased a kit for both my son and myself.  However, I never sent it in, lol.  So, I gave my kit to my son's girlfriend.  They have recently sent them in and are awaiting the results.  I could probably learn a lot from my father's findings, however, he wants to keep in information private and not reach out to the "DNA community".  I have though, seen his reports and there is a strong link to Ireland/Britain.

I thank you again for your response,  Wanda Heming

Wanda:

I will try my best to answer your questions.

Yes, likely O'Meagher was a family surname. I'm not aware that it was common to take a family surname as a middle name. FYI. There was a very famous Meagher in the mid 19th century. 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thomas_Francis_Meagher

I would agree that Mary Fitzgerald likely was a relative possibly. I'm curious if possibly Jane/Janet Holmes was married before.Maybe she was a Fitzgerald originally. Just a thought!

There is no data bank of ship's leaving Ireland in the 1840s-1850s that I'm aware of. Many landlords assisted emigration in order to clear tenants off the land. Some of these organized efforts are documented. Here is one effort but it only applied to female orphans. http://www.irishfaminememorial.org/history/earl-grey-scheme/

No way to know how the Sarsfield's were able to purchase the fees to cross the Atlantic.

Too bad that you did not test your DNA. FYI many sales going on right now. You can learn a lot by contacting matches (and hopefully they respond). I have broken down some brick walls in my tree and also my wife's tree.

Roger

Roger,

Thank you again for your response.  Those theories are all some of the ideas that I have had.  And I have also concluded that my family surnames were not that prevalent in the areas in which they lived.  I also knew of the famous Meagher in Co. Waterford.  His home was what is now the Granvill Hotel in Waterford, correct?  I've also read that he was responsible for forming the Irish Brigade for the Union Army during our American Civil War.  From what I recall, he has a fascinating story.  I will definitely check out the link you supplied.

I'm thinking that my only next step from here in the States is to contact a genealogist in the Waterford area to conduct a search for me.  I would really love to discover from where my family originated.  I'm sure you can attest, one develops a sense of kinship that grows stronger with every little bit of evidence they discover.  I feel that I know some of my ancestors so well, and they are all very special.  

Thank you again for your assistance.  If, in your research you come across my O'Maughr-Sarsfield-Holmes family, let me know!

With many thanks,

Wanda

Dear Roger,

Since your last response I have truly considered the possibility that my ggg-grandmother Jane Holmes may have been previously married, and whose maiden name was Fitzgerald.  The marriage record on rootsireland.com does not state whether she or James were previously married.  I did find two baptismal records on rootsireland.com that may be relevant:

Johanna Fizgerald, baptized 05 Jul 1820, Stradbally; father - Richard Fitzgerald, mother - Bridid Mooney

Joanna Fizgerald, baptized 09 May 1816, Dungarvan; father - Anthony Fitzgerald, mother - Mary Marks; Address: Blackpool

I have not been able to find any records related to the marriage of Jane to a Holmes though.  So, certainly another clue to try to trace.  

However, I do have another question for you.  On the 1850 US Federal Census, my ggg-grandfather James Sarsfield is listed as a "gardener" by trade.  This seems to be fairly specific, as opposed to the more general term of "farmer".  What exactly was a "gardener" in the 1840's of Ireland?  Does this infer that he was employed for this occupation?  Would this have been for an estate or such?  Or would this be a more generic term used by the peasant class performing farming for the landlords?  And, he was somewhat itinerant as well, having lived in Stradbally, Abbeyside and then Ballylooby.  Were the Irish a migrant people of that era?  And what circumstances would encourage/persuade/force one to move?

I am probably a little over-hopeful that James' trade can lead me in the direction of finding my family's origins.  But, it's probably worth a shot!

Thank you,

Wanda

Hi Wanda!

A gardener in Ireland would have worked on an estate of some sort. Maybe his employer asked him to move to another property in Waterford to tend to the grounds. Really hard to tell. There was some migration usually to find a work opportunity and also in the famine period many Irish were moved off of the land they were leasing and theyn either emigrated ot moved to another part of Ireland.

Roger

Hello Wanda, I read with interest your posting regarding James Sarsfield from County Waterford, Ireland. Interestingly my gr grandfather was a James Sarsfield too, however from Co. Wexford, Kilmannock Estates - townland. The passage to Canada from Ireland was cheaper during famine times than it was to the US. For some Irish fleeing the famine, they would take advantage if the cheaper passage to Canada, and then travel on to the US after arriving in Canada. Unfortunately Canada only began keep records of arrivals in 1865. There are records of the deceased who are buried at Grosse Iles. I have found no deceased Sarsfield buried at Grosse Iles. An early City directory for Toronto may give you some clues. Some of the City of Waterford Sarsfields are related to me. Some of the Dungarvan Sarsfields also settled in the Annapolis Valley of Nova Scotia, where their  descendants still reside today. Years ago, my wife and I met some of them. 

Hi there, I'm still based in Waterford and I'm also descended from the Sarsfields from here in Waterford. 

William Sarsfield I (born 1814 in Co. Wexford) was my great-great-great-great grandfather. He had a house and farmland in Kilmannock, Co. Wexford (not far from Waterford City). The property is listed on the Griffith's valuation of estate/land records. Just search for Sarsfield and you'll find it. 

William had a son William II (born 1841 in Co. Wexford). 

William II moved to Waterford city at some point, settling in Francis Street. He married an Emma Bryan (Aka Emily Brien) in 1865. 

They gave birth to another William Sarsfield III in 1875, John Sarsfield 1880, Robert Sarsfield 1883 and George Sarsfield, 1888. 

The Sarsfields in Waterford/Southwest Wexford were all related, so if I can help you in any way, shoot me an e-mail at seanuabriain@gmail.com and I'll try help. I'm also on 23andme.com if you need to check DNA relationships. I have my family tree mapped out pretty well for that side of the family.

Just to add to my previous post as I did some further research last night and today.

William Sarsfield (born circa 1814) was married to a Catherine Wise (also born circa 1814). They had 4 other kids besides William II from what I can see. Robert, W James, Margret and John Sarsfield. All from Kilmannock in Wexford and born between the 1841 to 1851. Feel free to contact me at any point. 

Regards,

Sean

Email: seanuabriain@gmail.com